m226 Chromoly Axle Shafts, need 20 people to get STEEEVO to make them!!

N.Y.X.

Bought an X
Location
Denver, CO
http://www.thenewx.org/forum/showthread.php?p=1975593#post1975593
This thread was started by westracing01.

I've been talking with Steven at Rugged Rocks the last day or so about his thoughts on Chromoly Axles for the M226. My thought was to make them for the Non-Locking M226's, which would mean they would also work perfectly well with all the aftermarket carriers. Below is the email chain:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
Steven,
With the release of the RCV M205 shafts, what do you think the prospect is of getting some Chromo shafts made for the M226? It would seem to me that if guys are willing to put down the $2K for the CV's they'd be willing to pony up for some Chromo rear shafts to make the rest of the drive train equally formidable.
We (member on theNewX) contacted Moser a year or two ago about getting some made but they wouldn't confirm what material they were going to make them out of and nothing ever came of it. I'm sure you have better contacts than we do and could get some done. Group Buy up front to get the ball rolling like you did for the ARB M205 might do the trick to gurantee enough round 1 sales.
Personally, if this went anywhere, I'd have them made for the Non-Elocker M226's since those would work in the ARB/Tru-Trac/Grizzly Locker trucks too.
~ Mike Ross

P.S. If you got this email twice I apologize. My email went screwy for a minute.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven
Hi Michael,
This is something that has crossed my mind.
But do you feel that there is a need for these?

The axle shafts are nearly 1.5" in diameter which is a Dana 60 sized axle shaft.
I'd see the ring and pinion failing before an axle shaft breaking.
Do you know of anyone on the boards that has broken one of these stock shafts?


Steven Lutz
President
Rugged Rocks, LLC
Sales & Support: (909)547-4651
Nissan 4x4 Parts / Off Road GPS Units & Maps




Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
I'd have to dig around. I'm not sure if anyone has straight up busted a shaft, I know a couple have twisted the splines but I think they might have had other issues that contributed.

I know the M226 is a pretty stout piece as it is, even more so when you put an ARB or other carrier in there. I was thinking more along the lines of better to have it and not need it, then need and not have it.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven
Go ahead and start a new thread on the new X and other boards if you can.
I just put this on the list of newsletters/blogs to write. chances are it won't go out until late october at the earliest if I start sending newsletters twice a month and bump it up a little. I have a good list going right now.
Once it does go out, we'll want to update the threads with a list to the blog to collect the feedback from all the forums in one place
then we can make decisions from there.

I would need to make 50 shafts.
We would need to have about 40 of those shafts spoken for with pre orders.
the price would be about if not exactly 279.00 each

Let me know what you think.

Steven Lutz
President
Rugged Rocks, LLC
Sales & Support: (909)547-4651
Nissan 4x4 Parts / Off Road GPS Units & Maps




The last part there is the most important. If you're interested, post up and we can start keeping track. This would work just like the M205 pre-order in theory. Comments, feedback, bring it on.

EDIT: List of those willing to throw down on a pair of Axles

1. chrishaynesusa (Xterra)
2. westracing01 (Frontier)
3. SoCalXTerry (Xterra)
4. skibum315 (Xterra)
5. golf286 (Xterra)
6. cutfromabove (Xterra)
7. JeniorNV (Frontier)
8. Nomad13 (Frontier)* (If splined long enough to be cut down for OEM E-Locker M226)
9. GuerrillaXT (Xterra)
10.
11.
12.
13.
14.
15.
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
 
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N.Y.X.

Bought an X
Location
Denver, CO
From thenewx:
They're not Chromoly. Most likely SAE 1030 carbon steel.

Billavista Explains

That's a great article for axle shaft tech. Hardening, material, etc. Loads of info in there and a breakdown (older but valid) of what the aftermarket guys use.

N.Y.X. - I believe yes, if we had 20 right now they'd be ready for Christmas but Steve would have to confirm that.


I'm no expert, but cursory research shows the stock material is likely some form of carbon steel (I'm seeing many references to 1040) with some hardening being the only likely modifier (and then possibly only induction hardening along the length of the shaft) ... think mass market and easy to produce.

Chromoly is more difficult to work and therefore not likely a first choice where it's not needed for the increased strength and longevity ... but someone (Mr_Scott?) with non-functional stock unit could always send a sample for analysis. Or maybe one of the OEM gurus (SteeevO? Cyclemut? Surf and Snow? Brutal? GrandpaX? Creek?) knows the answer and could be pursuaded to chime in ...

ETA: Dangit Mike!! ;) ... good link, love the Billavista articles.
 

metzican

Suspension Lift
Location
Lafaytte, la
what is the weakest link in the drive system after this is done? If no one has broken an oem one yet and people have defiantly busted up spider gears in pre 09's. I understand it is assumed you have an arb to ensure high strengths vs stock spider gears. But me personally I would rather change out an axle and deal with a broken one then gears/e-locker. Now if we know the U joints are the next weakest thing I can understand the upgrade.
 

J Everett

Suspension Lift
Founding Member
Location
Houma, LA
If someone ever breaks an axle shaft, send a piece of it to me and I will send it to my lab to confirm the chemistry.

Chromoly is a carbon steel; It deos have a lower carbon content than 1040 (.27 to .33% vs .33% to .43%). Chromoly is generally a trade name that commonly includes all of the SAE/ASTM 41XX grades of steel and it is very, very common in bicycle frames and the oil & gas industry. 95% of the material I approve for use in our machine shop (we mostly machine drilling riser connectors) is 4130 and 4140, and it is not hard to work at all, so that argument is BS. 1040 would be cheaper, and that is likely all the reason Dana or Nissan (does Dana build the M226 for Nissan, or does Nissan build it under license?) would need to use it as axle shafts over heat treated 4130 (just heat treating 4130 usually costs me more per pound than the actual cost of the raw material). 1040 can be heat treat to a fairly high ultimate tensile strength, not as high as 4130, but the higher hardness and tensille you heat treat 4130 to, the more brittle it becomes, which is a concern when it come to shearign splines. I honestly could not justify buying new axle shafts unless I broke one, or anyone could positively identify the raw material of the the stock shafts and send me an MTR for the chromoly shafts before I bought them.

Don't get me wrong, stronger shafts definitely appeal to me, as would stronger carriers. I would consider the investment, but I have to be assured that I'm getting what I pay for and that it is a major improvement. Just calling it chromoly doesn't tell me anything.
Tell me the actual grade, show me the UTS and yield, tell me CVN test results and Brinell or Rockwell hardness (on both the stock and the aftermarket shafts) before I drop a large sum of cash on them.


Now, 4340, while still being a low-carbon chrome and molydenum steel alloy, is not in the 41XX series of alloys but is still called chromoly outside of the oil & gas industry, but would be crazy tough as an axle shaft, especially heat treated or case hardened. That would be a nearly bulletproof axle shaft, but I also think it would be mad overkill.


TLDR: 1040 might be tough enough. 4130/4140 probably not significantly stronger to justify expense. 4340 significantly stronger than 1040 but might be mad overkill.
 
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SteeevO

First Fill-Up (of many)
Location
fontana,ca
They would be 4140 just like 90% of the other aftermarket axle shafts in the off road industry for axles from Dana 30s on up.
 

Golf286

Wheeling
Location
Niwot, Colorado
Hey guys,
For what it's worth I just had to replace the pass side rear axle today, because the splines twisted.. If you have to purchase OEM rear axle shafts it's gonna set you back about $450 per side, personally I'm buying The Chromoly ones!
 

SteeevO

First Fill-Up (of many)
Location
fontana,ca
Those that are still interested in these, please email me with your contact info so I can add you to an ongoing list of people interested. I havent put this project to rest yet.
 
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