Nissan lockers for $299!!!

TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
Hey, I was talking to Lokka (In Australia, they are the parent company for Aussie Lockers, etc...) and it turns out they are willing to do an experiment to gauge interest in Nissan products.

They have carried lockers for Xterra, Titan, Armada, Pathfinders, Frontiers, etc for a decade or so, but in the USA, saw little to no interest.

They are willing to do a 2 week sale on ALL Nissan products to see if it was their USA distributor who was simply not pursuing the market, or, if it really is just jeepers here.

I know these lockers from the jeeps and Toys, etc, and they are truly different in the way they work, and, no one I know at least has broken one.

They install in an easy driveway project (No gear lash or other complicated stuff, they essentially drop in w/o taking out the gears or changing carriers, etc)

They only have FRONT LOCKERS for us from what I can tell, but, its the fronts that every one has trouble finding.


These work by allowing differentiation to occur easily and quickly...so you don't get the chirping and so forth you get with other autolockers.

Essentially, they are always locked, and never unlock, BUT, if the road, etc, is making one tire go FASTER (The outside tire on a turn), it LETS that one go faster, but, is still driving the slower/inside tire.


So if going in a straight line, both sides are locked and turning at the same speed.

If you take a turn, about the force needed to click a pen is all it takes to free wheel the faster side, and it just lets it...and you corner as normal.

For part time 4WD rigs, of course the front diff is out of the drive train in 2wd anyway.

So there's no dash switch, no compressor/OBA required, no wiring, its automatic.


Off road, a front locker adds more performance than a rear locker can, because on an IFS rig especially, its the FRONT that tends to slip.

When an open diff slips a front tire, the OTHER tire is idled, and you are in RWD.

When climbing for example, the rears have the best traction due to weight transfer, and additional wheel travel/articulation....and are less likely to slip.

As a locker ONLY helps when a wheel slips, by making the other tire keep driving the rig instead of standing by w/o helping, a locker helps most on the axle that is most likely to slip. (If you never slip, a locker will not ever help, and you don't need one)

So for an IFS rig with less wheel travel up front, and, the weight transferred to the rear when climbing, the front is where the locker will help the most.


TRADITIONALLY, a front locked rig is too hard to steer compared to a rear locked rig, so the dogma was to lock the rear if only doing ONE end (But to always lock both ends for BEST performance)

With the ability to allow differentiation though, the Lokka is easier to steer than other locked fronts, as the outer tire CAN go faster than the inside tire...and the inside tire is still being driven by the gears. (There are no conditions where neither side gets power, it's always locked)


If you use an ARB for example, if you try to make a sharp turn when the front is locked, you tend to plow ahead (understeer) because the two sides are forced to turn at the same speed, even though the outer tire has a longer arc to follow, so there HAS TO be slippage to allow that w/o breakage...and that skidding is what causes the understeer.

You can of course unlock the ARB, and have an open diff, and, if its slippery, you are essentially in RWD because the open diff will do what open diffs do, which is to steer easily, but not pull you anymore when one side slips.

With the Lokka, you would be steering with both front tires, but still pulling with the inside one.

As far as traction goes, that's the same as with both sides locked in a turn, but only one side having traction (Or there would not be slippage in the first place, etc).

So, straight ahead, locked = locked, and the ARB and Lokka would be exactly the same. In a turn, the Lokka would still allow a locked turn because it can still differentiate, but the ARB would turn much wider due to understeer unless you unlock it or, if you have a manual hub, freewheel one side manually to allow differentiation.

Again, its the ground/road itself that would make the outer tire go faster and cause differentiation...if the ground is covered in ice for example, and is not giving enough traction to rotate the tire faster, it stays locked.




So, for $299 delivered (USA, UK and Canada) - you can lock your front diff.



I am pasting what they sent me after the conversation to tell you how to get the deal:



==============================

Gear to Goannawhere will be offering a special release sale price across the entire Nissan small to medium model range which includes the Xterras, Frontiers, Navaras, Pathfinders, Terranos, 720's etc.


This will cover a huge range of our Nissan Lokka diff lock models and a huge range of vehicle applications including most 2 pinion and many 4 pinion differentials. We don't do everything but most are covered.

The Sale Price for all Lokka Differential Lockers will be $299US including free delivery to USA, UK, Canada.

Other countries will have different freight costs so I cant list all of those but the same discount has been applied to everyone so it doesn't matter if you are Japan, Canada or Mexico the discount still applies.


To purchase you need to go to the www.lokka.com site.


Use the Lokka Wizard and enter your vehicle search details.

If you can't work it for your vehicle use the Inquiry form and send your request to us and we will send back a payment request for the right model - but quote the Voucher Code !!


Before checkout there is a page that will ask for a Voucher Code

The Voucher code is Xterra13

You must use that to get the discount

==========================



Spread the word, as its only for TWO WEEKS!


:D
 

mac11

Bought an X
Location
Nashville
Nice find TJ!!!!!! Everyone needs to jump on this!

It's not really a "find". This is the result of the interest shown in their product as of late since a member kind of stumbled upon the existence of an application for the Nissan, and the pursuit of knowledge about the product by those such as TJ which opened the eyes of the manufacturer.

This is a generous offer and a great deal.
 

Timrich

Super Duper Moderator
Founding Member
Location
Central FL
It's not really a "find". This is the result of the interest shown in their product as of late since a member kind of stumbled upon the existence of an application for the Nissan, and the pursuit of knowledge about the product by those such as TJ which opened the eyes of the manufacturer.

This is a generous offer and a great deal.

There, fixed the original statement for ya... ;)

Sent from over there...
 

TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
It seems the code was not activated yet....when it is activated, it supposed to work for all of the Nissans they carry Lokkas for.

As for the find, I saw a guy had posted about it, and I then contacted the company. Another guy had contacted me a bout setting up a group buy, and, the end result boiled down to this Voucher Code for all Nissans.

Until I talked to them, they (Corporate) assumed there was little to no US interest in Nissan stuff...and this is their effort to see what we might be interested in.

Its a 2 week experiment.

:D

Due to the time difference (Australia), they get back to me at night....so the code might not be activated until tonight/tomorrow AM, etc.


I will check it later to confirm.
 

Intender

Wheeling
Location
Lewisville NC
Well damn, I guess I jumped on it too soon. Either way I am still happy with my purchase. Also shipping was 4 days from Australia to the east coast, which is pretty good for free shipping. Once it hit LA it was overnighted to the east coast and on my porch the next morning.
 

04silverX

Bought an X
Location
Fort Mill SC
This is a great item from a great company. THey have had these lockers for my Isuzus for several years. Infact I have one in my Trooper but in the rear. I will say they are very loud and do bind up if you are powering through a low speed corner like in parking lots and such. Now I have friends with front aussies and they do make the steering very tight up front when wheeling but for the price you can't beat them and if you want your steering back you just unlock one hub and then lock it when you need both fronts griping. its a great asset to our community and for the price is amazing. Got to think about picking one of these up for me.
 

mac11

Bought an X
Location
Nashville
Hey guys, just heard back from Mark at Lokka. He wanted me to let you all know the discount code for the locker is good/valid but will not go live until this weekend as they have some configuration work to do on the back end. Hold off just a couple more days.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

rokdaddy

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
New Mexico
This looks like a traditional auto locker, I think it may be a Lock Right clone. If it's a typical lunchbox locker, there are a bunch of drawbacks that haven't been mentioned. Unpredictable handling on ice and snow, occasional loud popping sound that occurs when the locker releases after a high torque lock "bind", clicking sounds when making slow tight turns and potential diff damage if the axle/hub breaks under power.

There are pros and cons associated with auto and manual lockers and unless I'm missing something, the Lokka appears to operate exactly like other auto lockers. There's a good chance that this one shares some of the same negatives that the other auto lockers have. Auto lockers have as many fans as they have nay-sayers - they definitely have their place in the right applications.

It does seem to be a great price though... with overseas shipping included.


-Rok
 

Diadaga

Suspension Lift
Founding Member
Location
Virginia
Very interesting I will have to look into this. It its got TJ backing it then I'm not too worried about the nay sayers.

Sent from my mansion in Grouchland.
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
How many threads does there need to be on this?

It's a lunch box locker, that's all. I hate them! I had one in the PhoeniX with the D44 up front and the spool in the back. Couldn't make it through a small ice patch at all. It wouldn't keep traction without slamming my steering wheel side to side. And that was with manual hubs, 4Lo, 35's on FLAT ground! The one thing you have to keep on hand is the replacement pins that go inside. They're small, with a tiny ass spring behind them. In a regulate IFS rig, I wouldn't run one. First wheeling trip and you'll WASTE your idler and center link, no bull****. And get used to noise too, as they pop and snap like a Detroit in the back of an automatic. You won't like it.

It is a LocRite clone. The spider cross shaft is what does the engaging, pushing the two (one on either side of the cross shaft) cog plates into the matching cogs that the axles are splined to. With an automatic, there's constant pressure on that shaft, making the lunchbox always wanting to be engaged (when in 4WD). With a manual trans (granted, it would have to be installed in the rear, but the same principal applies), one would give it gas, start to go into the corner, then let off the gas, coast, in order for the lunchbox to disengage, giving a "smooth" cornering. In this regard, it's just like a Detroit locker. One of the main complaints from Detroit locker owners who have them in the rear is the loud banging and ratcheting noise from the axle when cornering. Most guys with automatic transmissions won't put them in there rigs because they tend to stay locked, unless you're throwing it into neutral when entering a corner. In dirt, with, either trans, it's essentially a spool (that what a locker does), but you can't disengage it.

For my 9", instead of spending money on a Detroit, even more money on ARB, I spent $18 and bought a mini-spool, good to over 350hp. But it was my rock rig, chirping tires on the street was a badge of honor for me. Not so much for the cops though.

But that's just my opinion, from experience.

And, no offense TJ, but just because someone endorses or doesn't endorse it, you should make up your own mind on things.

Take a gander at this, Aussie locker, but it's the same thing. This will be in the front of your truck.

[video=youtube;HF6tJvzlT7U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HF6tJvzlT7U[/video]
 
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TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
This looks like a traditional auto locker, I think it may be a Lock Right clone. If it's a typical lunchbox locker, there are a bunch of drawbacks that haven't been mentioned. Unpredictable handling on ice and snow, occasional loud popping sound that occurs when the locker releases after a high torque lock "bind", clicking sounds when making slow tight turns and potential diff damage if the axle/hub breaks under power.

There are pros and cons associated with auto and manual lockers and unless I'm missing something, the Lokka appears to operate exactly like other auto lockers. There's a good chance that this one shares some of the same negatives that the other auto lockers have. Auto lockers have as many fans as they have nay-sayers - they definitely have their place in the right applications.

It does seem to be a great price though... with overseas shipping included.


-Rok

Its a lunch box locker like the lockrite, etc, in that you can install it w/o needing to reset gears etc.....

BUT its not like them in operation because it operates differently.

That popping and skitter you get from a lock rite or Detroit, etc...is because the force needed to allow differentiation is very high, and the drivetrain winds up until something gives (Like a tire chirp etc)

Its that inability to differentiate with about the force it takes to click a pen, etc, that separates them in performance. For example, with a lockrite, its possible to make a sharp turn on the road and actually wind up the drive train to the point where you can lift a front tire for example...due to that bind tension.

That doesn't happen with the Lokka, as the wind up doesn't happen from the outer tire, which freewheeled as soon as the ROAD rotated that tire faster.

So, sure, any locker will be a little different in the way you drive it, but, the Lokka is built to be more street friendly and with an easier learning curve for sure. Again, the main difference IS that reduction in wind up and binding because it CAN let that outer tire freewheel easily. Of course, when ON the road, in RWD, its dialed out of the equation anyway.


I just confirmed, the Voucher Code is active now.

Xterra13
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
For example, with a lockrite, its possible to make a sharp turn on the road and actually wind up the drive train to the point where you can lift a front tire for example...due to that bind tension.

That doesn't happen with the Lokka, as the wind up doesn't happen from the outer tire, which freewheeled as soon as the ROAD rotated that tire faster.

A lockrite won't lift a tire. Been there, done that. On something super light, perhaps, like an Odyssey or something similar, but on an Xterra, no way, no how. It will break loose before that happens. The ramps on the cog plates will force it loose.

Lokka locker:

lokka-bg.jpg


Lock Right:

lockright_zps08ab8988.png


No real difference. You still have to take the power from the cross shaft to let it disengage, as in, let off the gas and coast to get the tires to unlock. Less tension on the pin springs won't make a lot of difference.
 

TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
A lockrite won't lift a tire. Been there, done that. On something super light, perhaps, like an Odyssey or something similar, but on an Xterra, no way, no how. It will break loose before that happens. The ramps on the cog plates will force it loose.

Lokka locker:

lokka-bg.jpg


Lock Right:

lockright_zps08ab8988.png


No real difference. You still have to take the power from the cross shaft to let it disengage, as in, let off the gas and coast to get the tires to unlock. Less tension on the pin springs won't make a lot of difference.


I hear you, but it does make a difference because it reduces the effect...IE: The force needed to allow differentiation is the issue in the first place.

You do not have to coast to disengage it, the road's traction on the outer tire simply rotates it instead of the side gears rotating it, and the side gears just continue to rotate the inner tire.


If the Jeeps that lifted a tire (This happens, last one I SAW was on a TJ) are light enough and the X is not, fine....but it seems like it won't happen on the X with this either.


Off road, you will have better performance with a Lokka than an open diff....and on road, sure, just like with any autolocker, there are some things to get used to.


If those things are worth a grand or two more and you want an ARB, that's fine. This is finally an affordable mechanical locker for the X.

It doesn't make bushels of Julianne Salad, work as a floor wax and desert topping, etc.


Look at the drawing, you don't have the same set up...its superficially similar, but not the same.


If you feel you're better off with an open diff, which IS the other option for most people w/o the big bucks for the ARB, that's ok, but for a lot of people, they'd rather have this locker than an open diff.

I'm just passing on the info that its available.
 
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drbandkgb

Titan Swapped / SAS'd
Founding Member
How would these work if you are looking to move into revolver shackles? Seems like a lot of suspension play...
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
So what you're saying TJ is that you haven't seen one of these in action, you don't have one in your rig, haven't had a lunchbox locker in anything that you've run and you're standing behind the advertising claims of a company in another country that wants to make a profit by selling a few here. Do I have that correct?

If you're positive that the traction of the outside tire is enough to break this thing free, under load, without lifting off the gas, then it's no better than an LSD, right?

But instead of the smooth disengagement of an LSD, you're going to have ratcheting noises, herky jerky steering and pushing on slippery surfaces and end up with worn steering components after a decent wheeling trip or two. I see.

So what IS the breakaway torque on the Lokka? You said that the traction of the outside tire is enough to counteract the forces of the spider shaft shoving them apart (torque multiplication of the gear ratio in 4Hi is pretty high, let alone going through the transfer case in 4Lo, but I digress) so that means that they've actually calculated the breakaway torque of their units (especially to backup the claims that they're better than a Lock Right, correct?). Is it close to a TruTrack? An Auburn?

Let's go back to that statement of "the traction of the outer tire...". If there's a certain amount of traction necessary and the engine's torque can break it away on the street, how much torque will it take to break it free on the rocks? You can't have it both ways, it's either a lunchbox locker or it ain't. You're saying two entirely different things here and only one can be true.

Let's recap:
It's not your old school lunchbox locker, it breaks away with street traction WITHOUT LETTING OFF THE GAS.
We don't know the breakaway torque of this device.
If there's breakaway torque, it's not a locker.
If it's not a locker, what's the benefit (besides damaging steering [at the minimum], hubs [more than likely] or CV shafts [worse case scenario])?

Or can someone from Lokka pop in here and dispel the cloud? It sounds like you've got an inside track. If they can school me on how their product isn't just a rehash of the Lock Right, hell, I've got several buddies that would pony up.
 

rokdaddy

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
New Mexico
Let's recap:
It's not your old school lunchbox locker, it breaks away with street traction WITHOUT LETTING OFF THE GAS.
We don't know the breakaway torque of this device.
If there's breakaway torque, it's not a locker.
If it's not a locker, what's the benefit (besides damaging steering [at the minimum], hubs [more than likely] or CV shafts [worse case scenario])?

Lunchbox lockers also tend to self-destruct when you break an axle shaft or blow a hub.

-Rok
 

rokdaddy

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
New Mexico
That's an interesting thought, Mr. Mut (you seem to be full of those). The incident that I witnessed happened too fast to tell but at the time, we were really convinced that the hub went first. You've got me rethinking the assumptions we made that day - funny how the things that we read in books, magazines and on the internet guide our assumptions.

Either way... that day, either the auto locker destroyed the hub or the hub destroyed the locker. End result: big pile of expensive scrap metal.

-Rok
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
The day I got towed out of the ice field on Left Hand Canyon, I went home and yanked the Lock Right out of the front. I ended up replacing the short side shaft (driver's) because I noticed the splines were tweaked. I may have not noticed them being that way when I put the lunchbox in there, but I'd like to think that it's something that I'd notice (especially since I noticed it when I took the shaft out).

But they were stock shafts, not chromo, with 35" XTerrains. I firmly believe it was the locking/unlocking of the lunchbox, cramming power side to side violently that twisted the shaft. If I had kept at it, I believe that I would have broken the shaft. My hubs were fine on that trip, Warn D44 units, behind 5.13 gears on a SuperCharged X running an automatic trans in 4Lo.
 

TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
The force to allow free wheeling was described as equivalent to about the force needed to click a pen.

(Not a lot)

I don't have one in my X because they just came out, but, the Aussie version has been in some people's jeeps, etc, and they love'm. That's what my Lokka experience is based on, because Lokka private labeled the Aussies for them, but, another company actually was involved with selling them here.

So, sure, for hard core use people break stuff, but, there is a tendency to blame the breakage on whatever happened just before that.

As a mechanic, you are familiar with those as the dreaded "sinceyou".

IE: Since you changed my tires last week, and today my radiator blew, what are you going to do about it?"

etc


So, people with open diffs blow them...people with ARB blow them. Diffs blow sometimes. I only blew one back in the 90's, and it was open, and I had one side spinning and the other not, and, the spinning side caught traction and bang, a c clip on a D35 went bye bye. If it had been locked, that would not have happened...then...as one side would not have been spinning.

So far, the Aussies that I am basing all of the Lokka stuff on, as its essentially the same thing, was a product I BEGGED Aussie to make for the X for years. They never did. Lokka did...so, that made me happy.


I'm pursuing all this in good faith, and, I'm pretty sure the Lokka will work like the Aussie's did in the jeeps, etc, and will be a good thing for an X to have....certainly relative to an open front diff.

Anyone who is willing to make the drivability sacrifices a lift, higher COG, MT vs hwy tires, etc, should be ok with learning to drive with an autolocker. If clicking and being smooth in transitions on/off the gas and so forth that a locker ask of you is too much, sure, stay open....just like if the noise of an MT is too much, you get AT or Hwy tires, and so forth.




As for the Revolvers, its not really related, as one just increases the down force of your tires in the rear, and one keeps the front end pulling.

"Unloading" is mostly a concept that evolved from those not getting the physics...and not getting that a coil sprung live axle is going to do the same thing they think happens, only more so, if it did happen, which it really doesn't...otherwise all the guys who have coil springs would be swapping on leaf packs so that their trucks don't fly up into outer space, etc.

Essentially, all a revolver does is simulate a longer shackle's swing, so you can droop more, and, when drooping, reduce the drooped pack's resistance so as to allow more down force on the drooped tire.

The added down force is typically allowing more traction, which is a good thing. As the shackle has a limited length, it eventually does what all shackles do, which is to run out of swing, and pull the leaf pack back up more and more...which is why all leaf packs cannot put as much down force on a drooped tire as a coil sprung live axle can, all leaf packs fight droop as they pass their neutral point.
 

rokdaddy

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
New Mexico
Hey TJ, you’ve done a great job researching these and you’ve struck a great deal for those who already know that these will work well for their own applications. My only concern is that these lunchbox lockers may not be the best choice for a lot of people who may be reading this. I’ve had several friends over the years that have had them, and the only people who were happy with them installed them in very roughly built, dedicated rock rigs.

Maybe ballpoint pen springs are the solution that the auto-locker industry has been missing all of these years but I wouldn’t be willing to recommend them based on a phone conversation with a manufacturer. From reading your posts about these, if I didn’t know better, I would buy a set and expect a herd of unicorns to fly out of the box when I opened it.

You’re a very well respected member of the Xterra community and you’ve helped a lot of folks over the years. It seems to me that the best course of action is to buy one yourself first, try it out, then recommend it if you think it’s appropriate for others. This may be the best invention since lubricated condoms but we won’t know for sure until someone with a clue proves them out.

Just my 25 cents (adjusted for inflation of course)…


-Rok
 
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TKDx00

Lockers Installed
Founding Member
I was asked this question and I honestly don't know the answer nor can I find a clear answer in this thread...

Is the issue with this Lokka only when the front traction 4Lo &/or 4Hi are engaged? When in 2wd, on pavement there are no issues.
 

Intender

Wheeling
Location
Lewisville NC
When in 2wd on a first gen you will not notice the thing even being there. It has nothing to do with the design of the Lokka, but to do with the fact that on 1st gens nothing in the front drivetrain spins when in 2wd. If you have manual hubs that are engaged but still in 2wd, the front cv axles will be engaged and the front diff will spin making the the lokka work and would cause resistance in the drivetrain, not sure how it would affect drivability or the noise it would cause. If you are in 4wd, with manual hubs not locked your diff will be spinning so it may make some noise but will not affect anything since the wheels will not be spinning with the diff. The only time you will notice this thing is if you are in 4wd with manual or auto hubs engaged, or 2wd with manual hubs engaged.
 
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TKDx00

Lockers Installed
Founding Member
I think I understand now...

A:
---When not in 2wd mode there are 0 issues. (unless you just like having you hubs engaged).
B-
--- If you're not a black trail person and stay to less demanding trails, as long as you're not a heavy skinny pedal driver you're ok.

The issues come into play if your X is primarily a dedicated &/or gt 90% most of the time off road vehicle that you are ready to beat up on hard trails(for lack of a better way to put it).

Fair statements?
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
Yes, kind of fair statement. But if you're driving in 4Hi, in the snow, you'll notice the difference too. So if you never engage your 4WD in the winter, it will be perfect. So a DD in Florida or another perpetually warm (non-4WD necessary DD state/province/country) they're OK.

But consider that the front end is locked, even on mild trails, even in a dirt parking lot. I highly doubt the advertised claims that the traction of one wheel will break loose the lunchbox and let it freewheel enough to not be a hindrance on your steering. If this is true, it's not a locker and will do nothing off road. You WILL HAVE to let off the gas in order to make this happen.

Just looking at the picture, anyone that's even remotely mechanical can see how it works.

When you put power to diff (go pedal), the spider shaft (labeled "pinion shaft" below) forces the two inner cog plates (labeled "driver" below) outward, into the matching cogs of the couplers (which are splined to the CV shafts) which turns the wheels.

When you let off the gas (coast), the pinion shaft centers itself and "driver" is allowed room to push back against the springs and pins, disengaging from the coupler (the ramps on the cogs of both the driver and coupler are angled to allow them to be pushed apart, but the springs and pins are pushing against the back side of the coupler, trying to keep them engaged), letting the wheels spin independently from each other.

When you use the engine to slow the speed of the vehicle, the motion is just reversed, causing the plates to engage each other and lock the wheels together again (just like going forward with power, only now it's going backward with engine braking).

lockright_zps08ab8988.png


This is pure physics. YOU HAVE TO LET OFF THE GAS AND COAST TO GET THEM TO DISENGAGE! There are no, nada, nunca, zero, zilch two ways about it. If it doesn't happen this way, something's broken.

If you plan on driving in the snow or ice on the street, you will also have issues.
 
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TKDx00

Lockers Installed
Founding Member
Thanks for putting this in terms a less than professional mechanic (like me) can understand. I understand a lot more but ask 1 last thing hopefully. On snow and ice I wouldn't be on the gas in a turn at least normally I wouldn't be unless I was making doughnuts. However on a trail or dirt parking lot I might be. If I understand your concern from the previous posts you are asking at what point or how is that point determined (slippage/resistance/whatever) will the Lokka self disengage and how much wear and tear it will potentially cause before that point on other parts?

I'm asking all this clarification because I'm seriously considering getting one. $299.00 vs. $1200.00 and the fact I'm among that less than 20% off-road group.
 

Cyclemut

Wheeling
Founding Member
Location
Morrison, CO
The answer to that question is simple. The point at which the Lokka will disengage can only be one point, and that point is when the front end is not receiving any power. If you have an automatic transmission, it can only be when you're maintaining speed, in the gear that allows it. This means that if you're doing 10 miles an hour, in 4WD, you have to be maintaining the speed with the throttle while manually selecting the gear. If you leave it in D, with the OD on, the transmission will automatically try to get to the next higher gear that's within range and keep pressure on the locker. So with an automatic, there is always tension on the drive train. This is also why folks with automatics don't like Detroit lockers, because they want to be engaged all the time because there's power going to the rear regardless if you're in 4WD or 2WD.

Or you put it in neutral while going around the corner.

If you're in 2WD, with the hubs unlocked, you typically won't have anything to worry about. It's only when you're in 4WD, no matter the situation, that you have to worry about it.

You could even have your hubs locked in, but then you'll get the ratcheting noise whenever the tires turn at different speeds (turns, parking lot, etc.) because without power from the transmission, the Lokka won't try to keep it locked. But the spring will try to keep the cogs engaged.

If you had the springs in hand, and tried to compress them with just your hands, you'll see that they're actually much stronger than the spring you'd find in a pen.

Look at the size of the wire for the springs and how tightly they're wound. Add to the fact that there are four (4) of them, the angle of the cogs and force necessary for them to be pushed apart if they were travelling in opposite direction (the coupler would have to stay with the axle, so it's travelling at the same speed as the tire it's connected to, the driver is driven by the carrier it's installed in and can't move due to the pins behind the springs and the springs are trying to keep the driver engaged into the coupler) and you can see that it will take a LOT more effort than clicking a pen for it to disengage. That's just part of the advertising BS that they're using to get you to buy it.

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TJTJ

Skid Plates
Founding Member
Location
NJ
Starting from straight ahead, its driving both axles with the Cam gears meshed to the Axle gears, when one tire starts to roll faster than the Cam gear is driving it (when cornering), it rolls off the cam altogether, then the little teeth ride up and separate the Cam/Axle gears...... so the outer side tire (which is now turning faster) is able to 'free wheel' around the corner. This is my understanding on how ONE SIDE rides up and unmeshes.

The other side stays locked/meshed and driving you.

Is a locker needed for a guy who is not doing trails that can be done w/o a locker is another question...but, this is for someone who wanted a front locker and could not afford the ARB.

I agree that a lockrite is not ideal for a DD for the same reasons you mention, and, if I thought this was a lockrite, I'd be less enthusiastic.

If what I've seen on jeeps was not representative of the Aussie, which WAS different in practice than a lockrite, etc, then I've been bamboozled, but, the Aussies WERE different than the lockrites, so, whatever the "pen click vs the hand pressure vs the coast vs riding up automatically" issues are just a version of mathematically proving if bees can fly, etc.

If I was told they didn't make ratcheting noises when in 4wd and on turns, or have any other effects, then my BS detector would go off...but the claims were in line with what I saw on the trails. IE: When locked, it drives like a locked locker, no difference, but, if when turning there's enough traction to rotate the outer tire faster, it just lets it. As to EXACTLY how much traction we are talking about...its less than a lock rite, based on what I saw on the trails, but, I didn't have a torque measurement.




IE: Its a more friendly version of the lockrite...made by a different company with a different manufacturing result. The teeth are shorter and fatter, with flat tops and straighter profiles for example, etc...so sure its superficially similar, and shares principles, but the execution is better.


If Its like it was on the jeeps, it will basically act like a tamer lockrite as far as manners. For 1st gen X's for example, 2wd is a non-issue, its invisible. If its slippery enough to need 4wd, then the front end will get more traction than an open diff, and that traction will involve handling and traction associated with a locker, with some breaks on turns due to better differentiation.

If you NEED 4wd for snow, you should NOT be going that fast, etc, because you STILL can't stop better just because you have 4wd, so if the ROAD is so bad you can't get through w/o 4wd, you should NOT be flying along at speeds that land you in a ditch/run you into a stuck car, etc....people need to use their noodles a bit.

:D
 
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