Funky Steering

[caseycamby]

After doing a little off roading over the weekend I've noticed a weird thing in my steering.. I didn't do any hardcore wheeling just a place I always go to.

But ever since going, it kinda seems like it wants to steer itself. Like I'll be going and I turn, at first it feels like it's hard to turn then it will give way and become easy to turn then I'll begin to feel pressure again. It just seems to do it on turns and bumps in the road. Also, I'll turn a little bit then I'll let go of the steering wheel to get wheels turned straight but they'll stay exactly where they were pointed..

To me it seems like somethings messed up in the pitman arm/steering box but I really don't have a clue. Those 2 things are about the only things in the steering I haven't replaced.

What do you guys think?? I need to get this straightened out before WENT!

 

[Roadwarrior]

I would also look at cleaning out your calipers, rotors and brake pads. I think I have a slightly seized caliper on one side, so when I brake hard it slightly pulls to the right.

I would look into that and see if you don't have some nast-ness wadded up in there.

 

[chuckamazuk]

Put a little lube in the idler arm bushings (spray the outside areas and it will penetrate). Mine was ceasing up and causing some of the symptoms you stated. Easy task that won't hurt either way.

 

[caseycamby]

Those are both good ideas I'll check into. It'll probably be Wednesday before I'll be able to get underneath it.

Chuck, what would you suggest spraying? I have some white lithium grease I keep in the X.

Also, do you think a bad alignment could cause this? I changed my centerlink a few weeks ago but I really haven't noticed it until this weekend. But just by looking at it, my toe looks off.

 

[Intender]

if you are toed out on both wheels it will do this. after I changed out all my steering stuff the combination of being toed out and the grassroots centerlink being so tight made it hard to drive. The steering wheel will just stay where ever I point it and never go back to center. I pulled out the tape measure and some string and pulled the toe in a bit and it got much easier to turn. I have been out of the loop for a while, but if you never replaced that upper control arm bushing that had play in it you might want to make sure its not gotten a lot worse. mine is bad enough that it throws my alignment off in every measurable way every time I turn the steering wheel.

 

[caseycamby]

I'm sorry, I misspoke.. I have positive camber. So if you're looking at it straight ahead, the bottom of the tires are pointed inward while the tops of the tires are pointed out. Which, could directly be because of those bushings. I'll have to check that.

If that does look like the problem.. Could I get these from the parts store? If so, would I look them up just like with stock control arms or do I have to look them up by a different vehicle? OR, do I have to get the specific ones from AC?

 

[Intender]

The upper control arm bushings can throw everything off, but I dont think it would do it enough to be visibly noticable. If you want to replace them, you will have to get the ones from AC. I called them about replacing them and they told me they are custom made specifically for their upper control arms, and they didnt know of any others that would work. if you really want to replace them before nxm you can order them or I still have mine sitting in the box if you dont think you can get the other ones soon enough. I want to say it took me about 6 or 7 days to get mine on standard shipping

I dont think positive camber would cause that problem. usually positive camber alone would cause it to be a little bit squirrely to steer, as in your car will want to randomly change directions from time to time, or seems really twitchy. positive camber is purely an alignment issue. if they are unable to adjust the camber any farther the only option is to lower the front by adjusting the torsion bars. if you crank it too far you reach a point where you have thrown off the geometry of the front suspension beyond the what can be corrected by an alignment. Thats why most people say make sure you have no more than 1/2 inch bump stop gap on the stock upper bump stops. but even that is just a rough guide, not a law. have you had your alignment checked since you put in the centerlink? my alignment was good before I put in my centerlink and afterwords I was toed out tremendously on both tires.

 

[caseycamby]

Do you need yours? If so, I'll just get it from AC. If not, I'll take them off your hands and that'll give more time for install.

I haven't had my alignment checked after the centerlink install but that wouldn't affect camber, correct? That's just with toe and my toe doesn't look off, as far as I can tell visually.

 

[BKxterra718]

You shouldnt need alignment after CL install. After any kind of wheeling though yes. Did you try bleeding the steering? Lift the entire front end and then open steering fluid reservoir and keep turning wheel maybe theres bubbles in there. Just throwin it out there. Autozone also sells a steering box rebuild kit, but I know some boys that just would rather buy a whole new one instead. Currently my grassroots no longer holds the bearings and its just got those shoulder bolts keepin it all together. Waiting for new CL


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[granitex]

Also it can be bad hubs, if they do not disengage it can cause binding in the diff can cause the same symptoms. basically what it does is throws off the alignment so that it is towed in.

 

[caseycamby]

It shouldn't be the hubs.. I replaced them not too long ago with manual hubs. It's still possible thought.. I'll check that. I could take the outter hubs off and drive and see how it does.

The more I think of it.. The more I'm thinking Jeromy's right. The bushings could be going bad and that's what causing the camber to off...way off. Thus, causing the driving dynamics to be off. I'm checking it tomorrow after class.

 

[BKxterra718]

All those bushings tie rods and bearings are wear and tear items that just have their own time. Replace them as necessary, but once you are fully lifted for an X and wheel often and hard, the steering will never be even close to perfect. However your pulling issue does sound weird because its not constant. I just re did my rear shoes and it would pull hard right when braking. So i loosened the right one a drop and now she's better. Id say lift her completely on jackstands and have someone brake in the truck while you examine each wheel. Also you can physically move each front wheel w your hands to test the steering left to right and up to down to diagnose whether its a ball joint, wheel bearing, or steering linkage issue. Also spin them by hand to see how well they spin, theres a possibility to have a malfunctioning caliper, etc...


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[caseycamby]

All those bushings tie rods and bearings are wear and tear items that just have their own time. Replace them as necessary, but once you are fully lifted for an X and wheel often and hard, the steering will never be even close to perfect.

I realized that.. I long time ago haha! It's the bitter truth.

However your pulling issue does sound weird because its not constant. I just re did my rear shoes and it would pull hard right when braking. So i loosened the right one a drop and now she's better. Id say lift her completely on jackstands and have someone brake in the truck while you examine each wheel. Also you can physically move each front wheel w your hands to test the steering left to right and up to down to diagnose whether its a ball joint, wheel bearing, or steering linkage issue. Also spin them by hand to see how well they spin, theres a possibility to have a malfunctioning caliper, etc...


www.justinandersdenmark.com

After class tomorrow the front end is gonna be jacked up and I'll find the culprit. I just know what to look for now

I have some pictures I took today of the tires. I'll post them up in just a second once I get them onto my photobucket.

 

[caseycamby]

Pictures

The camber is way off on the driver side. Not as bad on the passenger side. It seems like the toe may be a little off on the passenger side. That's just what I see haha

 

[Prime]

Wooooooooooowwwwww that's a lot of positive camber. Not only check your UCA bushings but the LCA ones as well. And I haven't read the whole thread, but balljoints?

 

[caseycamby]

Yeah I was actually talking to my dad today about it and I told him that the camber going out that bad all of a sudden had to be one of two things (or both).. Control arm bushings or ball joints. Tomorrow will tell and hopefully I'll get all this straightened out before WENT.

I know how to check the bushings but is there a way to check the ball joints? Or is the same procedure just check where the tire movement is coming from? As bad as that is, it'll probably be pretty obvious where things are hitting the fan.

 

[Prime]

Lift the wheel of the ground and try to shake it vertically. Perpendicular to the ground. If there's play they're bad. Also check for any tears in the boots. If you see any loose rubber, replace them.

Also keep in mind that the the LCA is sold from the dealer as one unit with the bushing and ball joint. As far as Nissan is concerned, the lower balljoint is not a replaceable part.

 

[caseycamby]

Lift the wheel of the ground and try to shake it vertically. Perpendicular to the ground. If there's play they're bad. Also check for any tears in the boots. If you see any loose rubber, replace them.

Say the UCA ball joints are bad... Would that also have to be an item I get from AC or could I get them from a parts store. If so, do I just look it up just by what the X is or do I look it up by a different vehicle... It seems like remember hearing something about Hardbody ball joints are what replaces the AC 3" lift ball joints... I could be completely wrong here.

Also keep in mind that the the LCA is sold from the dealer as one unit with the bushing and ball joint. As far as Nissan is concerned, the lower balljoint is not a replaceable part.

I've heard that.. I can't speak to the LCA bushings but I have looked up LCA ball joints at work and I can get them separately. I know Nissan doesn't recommend it or whatever but I know I can get the ball joints separately, if need be.. not sure about bushings.

 

[Prime]

Say the UCA ball joints are bad... Would that also have to be an item I get from AC or could I get them from a parts store. If so, do I just look it up just by what the X is or do I look it up by a different vehicle... It seems like remember hearing something about Hardbody ball joints are what replaces the AC 3" lift ball joints... I could be completely wrong here.

The uppers should be 95 Pathy I believe. And you can source those from whoever you like.

I've heard that.. I can't speak to the LCA bushings but I have looked up LCA ball joints at work and I can get them separately. I know Nissan doesn't recommend it or whatever but I know I can get the ball joints separately, if need be.. not sure about bushings.

That's why I brought it up. Specifically for the bushings. I'm not sure where you can get them if you need to outside of getting a whole new LCA. That being said, you might be able to get something universal if you know the measurements.

 

[caseycamby]

I'll have to check that tomorrow and see. It'd be nice to be able to get it from work and save a penny and the shipping is usually pretty fast and usually free. I guess it'll all come down to what is the problem causer under there I'm anxious to find out!

 

[BKxterra718]

Yea UBJs are from 95 pathfinders. Dude how you wheelin without spares of these?! Tilting the wheel is a good way to tell but if you wana be 100 remove the ubj and physically try to move it around. It should be real tough. I go to a local auto parts place here in brooklyn and get the uppers for around 40/pop for the Moog's. Lbj's I also use Moog. Only replace those when we break LCA's. Good to put a grease fitting on the BJs while your at it if they dont come w them. Also run your hand across your tires and see if the surface is warped. That'll add to steering issues.


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[caseycamby]

Just checked at work and I cannot get the LCA bushings. I would have to be the whole arm. As for the UBJs, we keep those in stocks and will run me at 25 a piece.

 

[caseycamby]

After checking everything... Both the control arms bushings and ball joints are in fine shape. There was little to no movement in them.

However, after inspecting everything.. The caliper was sticking on the passenger side. After taking the caliper off, mud was the culprit there. Cleaned everything up in there I got it back working good.

Also, be it a coinsidence or not.. I starting getting the annoying ball joint creak today. It's been awhile since I greased everything up so I did that today as well. We'll see how that goes.

I guess my next plan of action will be getting another alignment and seeing how it holds up..

 

[BKxterra718]

Nice. Its good to use antisieze up in the caliper since it rusts out and gets stuck often. Also you can always go to Nissan direct and get the bushings. I have double spares of everything always. Idk what year yours is but heres the schematic for my 2000x w using my vin. LCA bushing is part number 54560A. You'll need a ball joint press kit to install it or a socket you dont care about. You dont have to buy the whole LCA. Aftermarket LCAs are POS, w garbage parts. Unless its from a trusted site dedicated to offroading. But ive never heard of anything stronger than factory stock LCAs or me and my crew would be runnin them.

www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[DC xterra]

upper control arm bushings gave up on ya i had that before no way you can get aligment get them replaced and your set

 

[Pro-2X]

Duct tape?
Sent from my Lumia 1520 using Tapatalk

 

[caseycamby]

I checked that today and they seemed solid as could be...

 

[DC xterra]

did u lift the front end up by the frame and try to shake the wheel or rock it back and forward? is anything loose?

 

[caseycamby]

That's exactly what I did and it rocked the whole vehicle before the control arm mount to the frame would move. Same for the ball joints. The rubber in the ball joints looked to be in great shape as well.

 

[caseycamby]

Not sure if it's related to the steering issues but I've started to notice a whining noise coming from my rear end.....of the Xterra haha. Not sure what it could be.

 

[BKxterra718]

Oh boy. U sure its from the back? Imside/outside the truck? And not from the shifter inside? Thats what happened before my tranny died. Only things in the back that could whine i suppose are the dif exhaust driveshaft ujoints and kinda sorta tcase but not really. I assume it whines only on acceleration? Did u put her on all fours and slap it in drive and reverse? Putting her in the air helps. And btw i just rebuilt my steering this weekend i suggest if u ever do get all brand new linkage and replace at the same time.

www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[caseycamby]

I'm not 100% positive but it does sound like it's coming from the rear end. The sound doesn't change with the speed or RPMs. It seems to be worse around 20-40 and when it's cold when it's first cranked up. But, that could be because that's the speed I go down the driveway/road and once I get going I can't really hear it because of normal road and wind noise.

 

[caseycamby]

Something to think about... Do you think that adding a bunch of weight (rear bumper, tire carrier, full size spare, steel wheel, hi-lift) could cause the front to come up a bit and throw the alignment off?

 

[BKxterra718]

Please tell me you have no sway bars


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[caseycamby]

None in the rear. One in the front.

 

[BKxterra718]

None in the rear. One in the front.

You leave one training wheel on? For whaa? Kills your flex b.


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[Prime]

IFS on the first gen doesn't flex enough to warrant losing the sway bar. Now on a Titan swapped 2nd gen...... Yes.

 

[BKxterra718]

IFS on the first gen doesn't flex enough to warrant losing the sway bar. Now on a Titan swapped 2nd gen...... Yes.

Um, yes it does...

http://vimeo.com/78358451

http://vimeo.com/92776431

See?


www.justinandersdenmark.com

 

[caseycamby]

Best I've seen.. Removing sway bars doesn't do TOO much for flex on our trucks. But I've never really seen it firsthand.


HOWEVER! Just had the X looked at by the local suspension guru and he says the UCA bushings are shot.. Soo.. It's gonna be a rush to get these coming and installed before WENT. Wish me luck!

 

[Prime]

Removing the rear is a necessity. The front however, meh. I'd rather have the road manners and maybe develop some disconnects for the trails.